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Monaro Pioneers Newsletter


2016 Number 7



MONARO PIONEERS now on Facebook









On 2016-08-04 20:03, Wariwck wrote:

Proposed Change: Butt,  Charles Ernest (I22023)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I22023&tree=MP

Description: DEATHS
BUTT, Charles Ernest.
September 18, 1956, at Queanbeyan Hospital, of 72 Lowe Street, Queanbeyan. Loving husband of Maude Victoria, and fond father of Linda (Mrs. R. Worth, Newcastle), Hilda (Mrs. D. Worth, Newcastle), Freda (Mrs. Mowbray, Queanbeyan), Selwyn (Sydney) and Eva (Mrs. McCray, Brisbane). Aged 68 years.


BUTT. The relatives and friends of the late Mr. Charles Ernest Butt, of 72 Lowe Street, Queanbeyan, are respectfully invited to attend his funeral, which will leave the Methodist Church, Queanbeyan, to-day, Thursday, after a service commencing at 3 p.m., for inter- men in the Tharwa   Road Cemetery, Queanbeyan.
M. H. O'Rourke, Funeral Directors, H.O. and Chapel:Phone 52. 113 Crawford St., Qbn.
The Canberra Times ,Thursday 20 September 1956


Regards, Ian



On 2016-08-04 20:00, Warwick wrote:

Proposed Change: Sumner,  Agnes (I20306)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I20306&tree=MP

Taken ill at Moppity and convey ed in the ambulance to Young Dis trict Hospital, Mrs. Agnes Butt died in that institution on June 24. She was 79. Deceased was a daughter of the late Mr. and Mrs. William Sumner, of Braidwood, where she was born.
She was married at Yass to Mr. Thomas Butt, who died, about three years ago. Mr. and Mrs. Butt lived at Hall for many years, and after her husband's death Mrs. Butt went to reside with her daughter, Mrs. S. Stuart, first at Galong and then at Moppity. Mrs. Butt is survived by a son, Mr. William Butt, of Queanbeyan, and three daughters.  
The Braidwood Review and District Advocate,Tuesday 7 July 1942


Regards, Ian



On 2016-08-03 13:27, C Cannon wrote:

Proposed Change: Miller,  Henry (I137681)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I137681&tree=MP

Description: Twofold Bay Magnet : and South Coast and Southern Monaro Advertiser (NSW : 1908 - 1919), Monday 1 April 1912, page 6
...Mr. Henry Miller, a very [?] and respected resipent [sic] of the district, died on Saturday morning, aged 84. He was a pioneer of Bega, and had ac-quired a comfortable property at Stony Creek."

C Cannon
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian


On 2016-08-02 20:46, Alyson Hulley-Jeffries wrote:

Comments: I've just discovered your site and some information about my Hulley family.
I'm not sure how alterations/additions can be done, but want to let  you know that there is an omission in the listing of children born  to my grandfather George Gammon Hulley and his wife Elisabeth (note  's' not 'z') Emily White. There are seven children listed for them,  two of whom died in infancy (James and Richard). The omission  concerns their youngest child, my father John Henry Hulley whose  birth took place on on November 11th 1916. It was registered at  Moruya. Dad died on February 25th 1995 at Bega.
If you are able to make this addition i would be grateful.
Thanks,  Alyson
Hi Alyson,
Thanks for the information, we do have your parents in our database but did not know John Henry's parents until now. The detail we have on John Henry Hulley is born 9/11/1916 Kianga and
died 20/2/1995 Merimbula - buried in the Pambula cemetery along with his
wife Daphne Evelyn nee Williams (14/4/1918-9/8/2007).

Source - AWM Service record WW2 and Pambula Cemetery transcription
records. Can you please confirm your dates are correct?
Regards,  Ian

Yes Ian, that's correct. I assume that  now they'll link up? Mum is  the last child of John Williams and Maryann Theresa Williams (nee  Summerell).



On 2016-08-01 04:56, Raymond Wallace wrote:

Proposed Change: Wallace,  Maurice (I127843)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I127843&tree=MP

Description: Sources: marriage & death certificates.
married 26DEC1879 at St Gregorys, Queanbeyan, witnesses John Wallace & Ellen Oldfield (siblings)
died 31DEC1928 at Adelong age 79 years
buried Adelong RC

Raymond Wallace
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-08-01 04:38, Raymond Wallace wrote:

Proposed Change: Wallace,  William (I49885)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I49885&tree=MP

Description: born Castlematyr, Cork, Ireland
arrived NSW 03DEC1841 "Comet"

Death Certificate clearly states born Ireland, in NSW 61 years. Parents Richard Wallace & Johanna Desmond (supported by immigration records, both living in 1841).

Witness at marriage 08DEC1841 (less thn a week afer arrival) was John Broderick, under whose protection Ellen Connell came to NSW.

Raymond Wallace
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-08-01 04:43, Raymond Wallace wrote:

Proposed Change: O'Connell,  Ellen (I49884)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I49884&tree=MP

Description: Name is Ellen Connell
born Castlematyr, Cork, Ireland
arrived NSW 03DEC1841 "Comet"

Death Certificate clearly states born Ireland, in NSW 68 years. Parents Morris Connell & Honorah Scance -not listed on immigration records, came under the protection of John Broderick & his wife.

Witness at marriage 08DEC1841 (less thn a week afer Ellen & William's arrival) was John Broderick, under whose protection Ellen Connell came to NSW.

Raymond Wallace
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-31 01:30, David Smith wrote:


I am trying to track down information on a John Smith married to Frances Keogh in the District of Moneroo and the County of Auckland on 17th May 1847 he died on the 14th June 1866 at Buckby's Cropping.  I am a descendant 4 generation.  The eldest son John Walter Smith my great grandfather born 3rd November 1848 at Bobundara Creek Station, married Ellen Augusta Brennan on the 20th November 1873 at Sandhurst in Victoria before returning to Bobundara Creek Station, they had 11 children.  From what I have gleaned from church records John & Frances may have had at least 2 more children Eliza born 11th August 1850 and James born 23rd October 1852.  Information I have about John Smith is he came out from England at age 13 as a stable hand tending the first shipment of thoroughbred horses but I do not know the name of the ship.  Frances was the sister of a Mrs Reynolds of Adaminaby and she along with her sister  a Mrs Russell and a Mrs Taylor in 1837 were amongst the first women near Adaminaby to cross the Snowy River.  I would greatly appreciate any information or contacts you may be able to pass on.

Your Sincerely,  David & Jackie Smith

Hi David,

We do have some limited information on your GGgrandfather and his family in our database but it is not really helpful to you unfortunately.  We have identified 7 of the 11 children of your ggrandparents so hopefully you can help us by filling in the blanks.  Incidentally, Buckby's Cropping is most likely to be Buckleys Crossing now known and Dalgety.

Regards,  Ian

Hi Ian, 

Thanks very much for the speedy reply, John Walter Smith and Ellen Augusta brennan had 11 children, 6 boys and 5 girls they were as follows;

John James (Sanko Jack) Smith 1873 – 1942

Amos Alexander Smith 18/5/1876 – 3/1/1898 (Died after eating grapes, drinking water and riding into the mountains ages 21yrs)

Jane Elizabeth Smith 7/11/1877 –

William Henry Smith 12/7/1879 – 1/1/1964

Alice Margaret Smith 10/3/1881 – 5/1/1916

Frank James Smith 11/2/1883

Ernest Edward Smith 7/1/1885 – 4/11/1944

Emily J Smith 1887 –

Mary E Smith 1889 –

Ellen E (Nell) Smith 1892 –

Albert Herbert Smith 1896 -  17/3/1919 (May be an issue with this date as he died apparently after he was thrown from his horse at St George in Queensland aged 21)

I have a lot more info on the family, too much for one email.  I've just set up an account on Ancestory.com if you’re interested.

Regards,  David & Jackie Smith

Hi David,

Unfortunately I don't have an Ancestry account so am unable to see your information.  Are you able to produce a descendants report containing all the Smith family information?

John James Smith 1873-1942  do you have any birth or death certificates for him?  We have John Walter Smith born circa 1873 and died 16/1/1945 in Lewisham Hospital and buried in the Old Adaminaby Cemetery (headstone photo in our database).  John Walter married Laura Elizabeth Russell 1908 in Cooma.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-30 23:58, Sandra Rolls wrote:

Ian here's some stuff to get you started

John stephens 1826       his occupation was a teslolor  (I don't know what this is if you do please let me know)

father of john    Richard stephens     b. 1802 carvan Ireland     d. 1857 braidwood nsw berried braidwood 

mother of john  Bridget   manghan    b. 1805 carvan ieland      d. 1891 denneliqune nsw 

children of Richard and bridget

1. Richard digby stephens

2. James stephens

3. Thomas stephens    b. 1830 - 1901 

3. Elizabeth   stephens b. 1831   b. 1831 -

4. John Richard stephens  b.1826   baptised 14/3/1827  carvan Ireland 


Richard  stephens  b.1802   d.1857

father of Richard    john stephens   b. 19/9/1779   carvan ireland  d. 21/12/1833    NSW

mother of richard   mary ann passmore

they married in 1795

chidren  of  Richard and mary

1. john   b. 1799   d.1879

2  Richard    b 1802   d.1857

3. Mary


5 william



 children of mary  a stephens  1851 and  walter james scott

daug, hleanor is actually Eleanor Payton

jane a Harrison died 1931 at Ryde NSW

louisa Harrison  died 1919 in Sydney


Elizabeth stephens   b. 26/2/1857   d. 1929 Goulburn

William stephens   b. 14/2/1862   he never married

George stephens   b. 9/4/1866    d. 1945         married   Emily M Watson    1897  at Nowra

kids Emily  m 1894 in Sydney before perents married  unsure if George is father


Benjamin stephens   b. 11/1/1869  


Thomas stephens     b. 28/8/1871          he married Esther Ann Butt  1903 at crookwell  she was born 1881 at crookwell daughter of Charles and Rebecca Butt


henry james stephens   b. 20/10/1874


will send other parts of the family soon

yours Sandra Hopkins

Thank you Sandra,

Do you have a Marriage Certificate for Thomas Stephens and Esther Ann Butt?  We have a different Thomas as husband to Esther Ann.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-29 11:58, Terry Collins wrote:

Proposed Change: McGovery,  Hannah Martha (I267400)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I267400&tree=MP

Description: Hannah's last name was McGovern not McGovery as on BDM, she was born at Eden in 1912, her name being recorded as Anna M McGovern. In the newspaper report of her wedding http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article125752186 it clearly gives her name as McGovern. She is Person ID I299696 McGovern, Anna M  the daughter of Patrick and Isabella McGovern.

Terry Collins
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-28 19:59, Lesley Bray wrote:

Hi Ian
Came across William George Blake on your Monaro Pioneers Website. I163169.
Can tell you I was married to his grand son many moons ago and he did not die in Maryborough in 1948 nor was he buried there.  He died in Southport in 1953 and is in the Southport Cemetery along with his wife.  You have that he was born in St Leonard's Nsw.  I have not been able to find where he was born and can find no proof that he was born in Nsw,  His mother's name was Ellen.  I have found a family in England where he fits perfectly but of course have no proof.  I think I would need to purchase his marriage certificate to see if that yields any clues.
Many thanks
Lesley Bray

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-27 07:32, robyn wrote:

Proposed Change: Collins,  John (I9420)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I9420&tree=MP

Description: John Collins died 1928 Delegate

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-25 00:35, Judy Peters wrote:

Proposed Change: Pirie,  Andrew (I208109)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I208109&tree=MP

Description: Death certificate details Manilla NSW 1919
20th June 1919 District Hospital Manilla NSW
Andrew Pirie, Carter, male, 55 years
Cause of death: a) Influenza 6 days b) Brochitis 14 hrs Pneumonia 12 hrs - Medical attendant:Hugh Layson, registered
Parents: Andrew Pirie, Sawyer, and Alison Armour
Buried 2? Jun 1919 Manilla Cemetery Undertaker: Mary Elliott
Minister: Wm W Thompson, Irish service,Witnesses: G H H Lane & ?as G?hodger?
1st marriage: Cowra at age 25yrs to Eliza Adnum
Children 1st Marriage: Andrew J 29 (yrs), George M 27 (yrs) living, one female deceased
2nd Marrriage: Muswellbrook 36 years to Sarah Rebecca Adnum
Children 2nd Marriage: Lily I 16 (yrs), Jessie M 14 (yrs), Edna M 12 (yrs)

Judy Peters

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-25 00:07, Judy Peters wrote:

Proposed Change: Pirie,  Andrew (I100944)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I100944&tree=MP

Description: From copy of baptism certificate supplied by member of the extended family ( Wendy Dawes ):-

Parish of Saint George Middlesex

Born 7 Jan 1815 baptised 12 Jan 1815
Andrew son of David and Mary Pirie of Harroll's Row, Merchant

Marriage Certificate: 11 May 1855 St Clements Yass in County of Murray by Banns
Andrew Pirie of Bogalong bachelor
Alison Armour, her mark X, spinster
Consent: not stated
Minister Chas. Ferd. Brigstocke
Witnesses: William Weatherby of Yass and Joanna Armour Of Talmur Bogalong.

Death Certificate: 1872/007321
4th January 1872 Yass
Andrew Pirie, Sawyer, male 57 years
Cause of death: Chronic ulcer of the stomach
Dr O'Connor 4th Jan 1872
Parents: Father: David Pirie Sawyer, Mother: Unknown
Informant: Alexander Armour, brother in law, Bogolong
Registered in Yass NSW 12th Jan 1872
Buried 5th January 1872 Bogolong by Alexander Armour
No minister in attendance, Witnesses Mc?Gain, Johnston and Thomas Drummond.
Born: London, unknown how long in colonies
Marriage at Yass age 41yrs Alison formerly Armour
Children: 5 females ans 4 males living

Judy Peters
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-24 19:44, Judy Peters wrote:

Proposed Change: Armour,  Alison (I208049)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I208049&tree=MP

Description: Death Certificate details 1904/007299:-

Died 9th June 1904
Alison Pirie ( widow )
female 73 years
Cause of death Acute Bronchitis
Congestion of the lungs 4 days
Medical attendant: R Crawford (registered)
Father: Matthew Armour, Grazier
Mother: Jean Nesbitt
Informant: William Drummond, son-in-law of the deceased, Junee Road, Temora
Registered by A J Napier 10 June 1904 Temora
Buried: 11th June 1904, Cootamundra Cemetery,witness - John William Richardson.
Born in Scotland, 62 years in NSW
Marriage: at Yass NSW aged 24 years to Andrew Pirie
Children of the marraige:-
Jean 47
Ann 46
David 45
Alison 43
Matthew 42
Andrew 40
Alexander 39
Marion 37

Deceased 1 female

Judy Peters

Regards, Ian



From: fairlight
Sent: 23 July, 2016 8:11 PM
Subject: Richard George Caunt


                 I just sent you an email about My Father Richard George Caunt , there is on more incorrect listing about him

He was not born Richard George Caunt  ( he was born Richard George Nicholls as per his NSW birth certificate he was registered under his mothers maiden name, his mother was not married at the time to Fredrick Caunt. his mother was Mary Jane Nicholls, his real father was Richard Alan Dengate of Grong Grong at the time he was there along with his brother building a dam at the time, he was from Camden NSW .

He was never adopted by Fredrick Wallace Caunt  but my father went thou life (army as well) as a Caunt even his death as a caunt


Regards Mr Peter Caunt  

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



From: Chris Clatworthy
Sent: 24 July, 2016 12:29 PM
Subject: Goodridge information

Hi Ian

some information on the Goodridge family. 


as stated before when my aunt Mrs Margaret Goodridge (Leslie Gordon Goodridge's widow) comes home from her cruise in Sept, I'll ask her permission to share some photos.


Chris Clatworthy (nee Hanbury)

Thank you, the marriage transcripts for the various Goodridge families were very helpful.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-21 05:36, Chris Clatworthy wrote:

Hi Ian  

I had trouble with the parents you had for Isabell Payne in the database, so I ordered the marriage certificate to confirm who was correct, and sorry to say but the database is wrong on her parents.(see attached)


Isabell Lucy's parent's names are Joseph Payne and Annie Jane Kohn. (have attached family group sheet)


I have a few other certificates if you are interested.
Regards,  Chris Clatworthy (nee Hanbury)

Thank you Chris,
Yes I am interested in any other documents you may have.
Regards,  Ian  

HI Ian

attached are certificates and a family group sheet for Caspar Kohn and Eliza Jane Berry


Philip Caspar Eric Payne (unknow as Eric Casper Payne) was married twice.

first marriage to Elise May Brown


QLD BDM online


Year     Reg#    First name(s) Person 1            Last name Person 1                First name(s) Person 2            Last name Person 2

1932    C338    Eric Caspar                  Payne                          Elsie May                                Brown


They had between 4 and 5 children. I'm hoping to meet some of them at Uncle Eric's second wife's (Norma Payne nee Hanbury formerly Bebbington) funeral on Monday, so I may be able to confirm how many children he had, if I do I'll forward his family group sheets.


I also have some information on the Goodridge family as one of my other aunt's marriage Leslie Gordon Goodridge (son of Nathaniel David Goodridge and Mildred Pearl Ferguson). the photo I have add of David Goodridge is one of Leslie's brother. I also have some photos but I need to get my aunt permission to share them but I need to wait until she comes home in Sept as she is currently on a cruise.

Hope the above helps.

Regards,  Chris

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



From: Denise and Ann Testa
Sent: 21 July, 2016 5:17 PM
Subject: Quinns, Ellen in particular.

Hi Ian, 

My name is Denise Testa and I am the great granddaughter of Ellen Quinn, daughter of John Lawrence Quinn and Ann Cole Moss.   I have details about her if you’d like.  I am in the process of putting all the citations in my family tree.  I was going to cite this page when I noticed that you had very scant details about her.   We wrote to a descendant in WA and they were quite sceptical that Ellen was a daughter.  However we have her birth certificate and she was most definitely a daughter of John and Ann.  I even have a piece of paper inscribed by Ann Cain (formerly Quinn and Colemoss) to my grandmother on her fifth birthday in 1903.

Ellen had a son out of wedlock, William John, born in Bombala in 1894.  He was killed in Ypres in 1917.   She then moved to Gundagai with her mother and some brothers and sisters.   There she married William Shiels on Jan 16 1897, also her own birthday.  On the same day she also gave birth to another son she named James Valentine Shiels.  He died at 3mth of age.   In 1898 she gave birth to my grandmother Annie Winifred Shiels, and in 1902 she had another daughter she named Eleanor Catherine Shiels.  She left Gundagai after this time and moved to Cooranbong near Gosford.  Why we don’t know.   She had another two daughters there by William Shiels.  In 1907 she had Elizabeth Manson Shiels and in 1912, Margrita Quinn Shiels.  Her first husband died in 1924 and she married William O’Neill in 1926.   She died in 1954. 

Regards,  Denise

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-20 19:58, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Dyball,  Thomas (I75434)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I75434&tree=MP

Description: Mr. THOMAS DYBALL An old identify, who lived in the district when the town of Cooma consisted of only one hotel, store, police barracks, and a bark hut, Mr. Thomas Dyball, died at the residence of his brother, Mr. Henry Dyball of Cooma, on Friday last, and was interred at the Cooma cemetery this morning. The deceased, who had reached the great age of 91 years, came to Cooma 18 months since and was confined to his bed during the past 15 weeks. He was a native of Norfolk, England, and at the age of 16 came to Australia with his parents, in the sailing ship Walter Morris, (Captain Morris in charge) the voyage taking no less than nineteen weeks. His parents lived at Woolway for some time, and Mr.Thomas Dyball followed gold mining at Braidwood, Bendigo, The Ovens, and Beechworth, prior to taking up farming in the Gundaroo district, and filling the position of overseer at various stations in the Queanbeyan area. He was married at Goulburn, his wife formerly Miss Maria Allan predeceasing him five years since and leaving no family. His surviving relatives are Mr. Henry Dyball of Cooma, and two sisters, Mrs. Marzol of Binalong, and Mrs Harding of Queanbeyan. and Mrs Hard, The funeral arrangements of the foregoing were carried out by Mr. J. F. Allen.
Manaro Mercury, and Cooma and Bombala Advertiser, Monday 26 May 1924, page 2

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



From: Joy Shepherd
Sent: 20 July, 2016 4:52 PM
Subject: Rayner Sawmills

Dear Ian

MY name is Joy Shepherd and I am a member of the Colo Shire Family History Group. I have been talking to Frances Gascoigne nee Rixon about the Rayner Sawmill at The Islands at Kurrajong. I grew up in Kurrajong North and knew some members of the family when they all lived at The Islands.


Weather permitting, we intend to go up to The Islands with Frances tomorrow morning, to try to establish just where the mill was, and the homes of the various members of the family. Frances tells me there was also the ‘big house’ which was also called the guest house.


The Islands is a gated estate so we have had a few problems getting in. The head of the committee is going to let us in.


Your article on the Monaro Pioneers has been most helpful, including the names of the children. As I knew the names Turner, Cootes,  Toms, as well as Rayner I could sort them out a little better. I never actually went out there, although my older sister and brother did.


I wondered if you had any further information, or even a map of how The Islands was set out. Any pictures would be wonderful. We would like to make sure that part of Kurrajong history is not lost.  I am also a little hazy still how Jim Rayner and the Haggarts fitted in. I knew those ones well, Jim actually was a guest at our wedding.

Kind regards,  Joy Shepherd

Hi Joy,

All the information we have is available on our website, not much help to you unfortunately.

Regards,  Ian


From: Beth Gibson
Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2016 6:34 PM
To: bdm-webmail
Subject: Query re records procedure

Good Evening,

I just want to confirm with you that the NSW BDM Register does record the actual date of Birth or Death and not the date on which they are registered.

I have been researching Births and Deaths in the 1890s.

Many Thanks,  Beth Gibson

Good afternoon

The registry does record the actual date of the event on certificates as well as the date they were registered. If you require further assistance, please contact us.

Kind regards,


Client Service Officer

NSW Registry of Births Deaths & Marriages

Website: www.bdm.nsw.gov.au 

FYI Ian.

Cheers, Beth



On 2016-07-19 00:00, Coleen Lett wrote:

Hi Ian,  I live in Brisbane I am keen to find my  GGGrandfathers place of burial.  I have located through this website some GPS coordinates that I am assuming are where he is buried.  It fits in with my research and if this GPS point is indeed his grave site I will be estatic.   GG Grandfather James Roberts born was born 31 Aug.1810 in Hampshire England.  He died on 6 June 1898 and was buried 7 June 1898 in Delegate NSW.  In 2015 my husband and I visited the Delegate cemetery and could not find a grave for him.  (Did find other family headstones which was fantastic.)  My research indicates he died at Delegate River somewhere near Bendoc Victoria. Which aligns with your GPS coordinates.  He had mining interests. In NSW and Vic.  I believe he or his son James Roberts JNR also ran A store and Inn in Craigie  1875-1876.  How can I be certain that the GPS location is indeed his resting place I would like to confirm that the site is indeed his grave we are planning to visit the area later this year early next year. It is a big country.  Hoping you can assist me.  Regards  Coleen Lett

Hi Coleen,

I am not sure which GPS coordinates you are referring too because until your email I was not aware that James Roberts was buried in the Delegate Cemetery.  None of the transcription records I have list James as buried in that cemetery which means he is most likely in an unmarked grave.  Thus no coordinates on our site will pinpoint his grave.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-18 04:23, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: McLaughlin,  Patrick (I7805)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I7805&tree=MP

Description: OBITUARY MR. PATRICK McLAUGHLIN The death occurred in St: John of God Hospital on Thursday, of Mr. Patrick McLaughlin, an old resident of Yarra. Mr. McLaughlin carried on farming pursuits and had been ill for some months his admission to hospital taking place three weeks ago. Mr. McLaughlin was a member of one of the pioneering families of Canberra, and was for 69 yeas ago close to where Federal Parliament House now stands. The whole of his life was spent in the Goulburn Monaro districts. Mr. McLauglin is survived by a widow, five sons and two daughters. The sons are Messrs. Les, Harry, Claude, George and William and the daughters, Alice and Vera. The funeral took place at the Catholic Cemetery on Saturday. Rev. Fr Carey officiated at the graveside.
Goulburn Evening Penny Post (NSW : 1881 - 1940), Monday 23 May 1927, page 2

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-18 01:01, Liz Smit wrote:

Sorry to send this in dribs and drabs ... not sure if this is more than you want to record.


I am descended from Mary Spence & Robert Burnett's daughter Jane (Mrs Robert Turnbull).

As you have on your website, after Robert Burnett died 1860,  Mary married William Heath in 1863. In 1874 they sold up and left Bega and moved to Sydney (it was said "for Mrs Heath's health").  Her sons Robert and Andrew stayed in the Bega district until moving their dairy interests to the northern rivers NSW in 1906 & 1907. Her daughter Jane married in Bega in 1875 to Robert Turnbull, a local teacher, and they moved back to Burrawang around 1889.


I am attaching a copy of an Obit for Janet Spence (Mary's mother ... arrived 1848 but listed as Margaret .. Mary mistaken as Marg.? )  as it gives some information on the family's arrival and settlement etc.  Family Ref F5973


best wishes .. Liz Smit


MARY ANN BURNETT – Person ID I124604

b  19.12.1858

d  11.8.1932  BDM  11367/1932

married George Robert Bartlett  BDM  1297/1886


1 ESME ADA BARTLETT  b 1892  d 7.9.1965

    married William Armitage

2 VERA E BARTLETT  b 1894  d 1894

3 ALFRED GEORGE BARTLETT  b 1895 d 1948 ret'd WW1 2nd Machine Gun

    married Winifred Buckland

4 IDA MARGARET BARTLETT b 1898  d 1976

    married Arthur Eccles Tipping


    married Harriet Rickards

6 STELLA MAUD BARTLETT  b 1889  d 1931

    married William Arthur Turnell




   b, d and marriage – agree



    married Burns Cummings


    married George J Ledbrook

3 ROBERT CHARLES STEVENS  b 1883 d 1918 France WW1

    married Sarah Isabella Barr




b 12.12.1860  (2 mths after his father died)

d 13.8.1944

married Isabella Ann McDonald


1  ALEXANDER JOHN BURNETT  b 6.5.1886  d 28.2.1957 

    married Alice May Hughes

2 DAVID PERCIVAL BURNETT  b 2.2.1888  d 2.8.1965 

    married Eliza May Parnell

3  WILLIAM ANDREW BURNETT  b 26.10.1890  d 19.1.1963 

    married Ellen Irene Clarice Ellem

4 IVY ELIZABETH MARY BURNETT  b 24.2.1896  d 2.1.1972

    married John Thomas Green

Thank you Liz,

There was no attachment,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-17 07:16, Diane Stark wrote:

Proposed Change: Burt,  Wilfred Sydney (I132011)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I132011&tree=MP

Description: Wilfred Burt is my grandfather. He married Constance Futter and they had two children.  My father John Antill Burt and a daughter Margaret.  Little is known of Margaret but John died in January 1999.  He was married to Jean Isobel Quinton, my mother.

Diane Stark
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian


On 2016-06-25 03:41, Kellie Brown wrote:

Hi Michael,

My name is Kellie and I used to devote many hours to the MP database but with work and family I can now only help in bursts and spurts.


I was just checking the LINKS page and think there are quite a few missing that are available that would help those researching.

VIC Historical BDM is now free to search (previously was pay as you go)

SA BDM is online and has been for years (I see a few new additions to MP have SA origins)


I could go on but thought I would check first and see if updating the LINKS section was something anyone was interested in. If members have the tools to conduct their own research (free) then we get further faster and (fingers crossed) more thorough and correct research additions to the MP database.


Even a mention in the newsletter to advise members of the new or updated links would go a long way to enabling research for the database.

I have spent many years collecting mainly FREE links and would be willing to send them all in as most of them are the "clinchers" which can help prove or deny family lines.


I have worked quite a bit with Ian who learnt how to 'put up with me' as I am pretty anal about researching but I am good at what I do. I hope to keep building with the MP and think an update of the links section would go along way to 'enabling' researchers to keep on keeping on.



Hello Kellie,

Thank you for your suggestion regarding links to BDM websites.  I am glad to say they have now been added to the website under the links tab from the main page.  Any further suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,  Michael



On 2016-07-17 03:01, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Nolan,  Mary Clare (I132503)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I132503&tree=MP

Description: OBITUARY
The death occurred at Queanbeyan yesterday in her 70th year, of Mary Clare Keeffe, widow of the late Jeremiah Keeffe, of Queanbeyan. The daughter of Michael and Mary Nolan, pioneers of Braidwood, the late Mrs. Keeffe, who was a very well-known resident, of Queanbeyan, was a native of Braidwood. Educated at the Braidwood Convent, she  joined the New South Wales Education Department as a pupil teacher, and her first appointment was to the Ginninderra School, and was thus one of the early teachers in what was later to be the Federal Capital Territory. She was later transferred to Williamsdale where she was married to the late Mr. Keeffe, who was a Monaro native and settler at Williamsdale. When Mr. Keeffe was appointed engineer of the Yarrowlumla Shire, the family took up residence in Queanbeyan. Mrs. Keeffe leaves a family of  three sons and five daughters - Clarence (Moree), Vincent (Punchbowl),  Louis (Queanbeyan); Irene (Mrs. Crowley of Queanbeyan), Bertha (Mrs. Byrne of Bega), Pauline (Mrs. Maher of Balldale), Bessie and Alma   (Queanbeyan).        
The funeral will leave St. Gregory's Church, Queanbeyan, at 3 o'clock this afternoon for the Roman Catholic portion of Queanbeyan Cemetery.    
The Canberra Times (ACT : 1926 - 1995), Monday 3 February 1936

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-16 17:32, Kevin wrote:

Proposed Change: McCauley,  Mary Jane (I122206)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I122206&tree=MP

Description: The Canberra Times (ACT: 19261995) Monday July 5, 1965. Page 11.

ROBERTSON, Mary Jane. July 3rd, at Queanbeyan.  Late of 4 Railway Street, Oaks Estate, ACT.  Widow of Walter Richard Robertson.  Loved mother of Vera, Thelma, Lillian, Harold. Alma, Leslie, Herbert and Una. Aged 78 years. At rest.

ROBERTSON. The relatives and friends of the late Mrs. Mary Jane Robertson of 4 Railway Street, Oaks Estate, ACT, are respectfully notified that her funeral will leave the Presbyterian Church of St. Stephens Morrisset Street, Queanbeyan after service to commence at 2.30 pm today, Monday, for interment in the Presbyterian Riverside Cemetery.
M. H. O'Rourke Funerals
Funeral Director,
Canberra - Queanbeyan.
Phone Qbn 52.
* * * * * * * * * * *

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-16 08:19, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Keeffe,  Irene May (I132504)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I132504&tree=MP

Description: CROWLEY, Irene May. October 28th at Jindalee Nursing Home. Formerly of 23 Cowper St, Ainslie. Dearly beloved widow of the late Charles Joseph Crowley. Loved mother and mother- in-law of Mary and John (dec) McBride, Joseph and Barbara, Desmond and Pat, Lucy and John Spears, Edward and Nan, Estelle and Peter Lawler. Loved grandmother of their children. R.I.P.
 The Canberra Times (ACT : 1926 - 1995)  Mon 30 Oct 1978  Page 12

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-16 08:16, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Crowley,  Charles Joseph (I132505)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I132505&tree=MP

Description: DEATHS
CROWLEY, Charles Joseph September 16 at Canberra, late of 23 Cowper St, Ainslie. Dearly beloved husband of Irene, loved father of Mary (Mrs J. McBride), Joseph and Desmond Canberra, Lucy (Mrs J. Spears) Orange, Edward and Estelle (Mrs P. Lawler) Canberra. R.I.P.

CROWLEY. The relatives and friends of the late Mr Charles Joseph Crowley of 23 Cowper St, Ainslie are respectfully informed that his funeral will leave St Patrick's Catholic Church Braddon, after Requiem Mass for the eternal repose of his soul to be celebrated at 10.30am tomorrow Wednesday for interment in the Canberra Cemetery. M. H. O'Rourke Funerals
Canberra Queanbeyan Phone Queanbeyan 52
 The Canberra Times,  Tue 17 Sep 1968  Page 17

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-16 02:53, Greg Keir wrote:

Proposed Change: Family: McElroy,  John / Hardie,  Janet

Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers

Link:   http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/familygroup.php?familyID=F128137&tree=MP


Description: John McElroy is believed (by family) to have been born in Scotland (Glasgow) not Ireland. Janet Hardie was also born in Scotland.


Greg Keir


Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-16 13:06, Ann Knight wrote:

Proposed Change: Nowlan,  Margaret (I209154)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I209154&tree=MP

Description: Although the 1839 immigration records for the family say they are from "Lochiel", I think the person writing it down might well have misinterpreted "Loughill" or "Loghill" (variation of spelling) when they said it in their Irish accent.  There does not seem to be a place Lochiel anywhere, but since they married at Loughill I would suggest this is where they came from as well.  They might never have seen what the person wrote down, and if they couldn't read anyway they wouldn't know it was wrong.

Ann Knight

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-15 15:43, Don Ryan wrote:

Proposed Change: Family: Duncan,  Daniel / Duncan,  Emily Emelia
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/familygroup.php?familyID=F38925&tree=MP

Description: Annie Duncan Born 1878
Married my G.Grandfather George Frederick Ryan
Bega Wesleyan Methodist Parsonage 26/5/1897

Mary Anne Duncan Married Frederick Burr

Don Ryan
Thank you,

Who is Mary Ann Duncan?  When was she born?  Who were her parents?  When and where did she marry?

Regards, Ian

Hi Ian,

Mary Ann's Marriage Certificate Says "Annie" (which is strange as her sister Annie married my Great Grandfather George Frederick Ryan and you wouldn't expect sisters to go by the same first name??)
She Married Frederick Burr 14th December 1889 Moor Street, Fitzroy, Victoria
Frederick was born in Wolverhampton England.
Frederick's Parents were William and Ellen ne: Sharplin
William was a Hotel Keeper and Frederick a Barman, most likely in his fathers Hotel possibly  in Flinders Street Melbourne
She was 22 and clearly states Born in Bega
Parents Daniel Duncan and Emily Duncan ne: Daniels
Search of BDM  fro her Birth comes up empty??
She would have been born between Hannah and William Duncan in 1967

Frederick and Annie (Mary Ann)  Children:

Daisy E.E. Burr b 1890
Frederick Robert William Burr b1894 d 1979
Mervyn Ernest H, Burr b1897 d 1971
Eileen A. Burr b 1899
Claude G. Burr b 1902

My Aunts notes say Mary Ann  remarried a Nolte,  but I cannot confirm this at the moment.


Thank you,

I have made the connection now.  Daughter Eileen married Hans Nolte.

Regards,  Ian

Hi Ian,

Fantastic, I had a quick look and makes a lot more sense now

I can share  some information on Mervyn Ernest H. Burr

He married Mary Rose (Cissy) Hancock  b 1911. Cissy  Was a Ballet- Dance Teacher in Wentworthville school of Arts in Sydney up until she retired well into her 90's)

#1:Marilyn Burr b 20/11/1933     http://dancelines.com.au/ivan-marilyn-long-loving-dance-partnership-linking-hungary-australia/

marriage  # 1  (Cant remember)  m #2; Jean Paul Comelin m #3.  Ivan Nagy.  Nagy’s dancing career reached its peak as a principal at American Ballet Theatre where he was known and much admired in Swan Lake, Giselle and Les Sylphides but also as a wonderful partner to such ballerinas as Margot Fonteyn, Natalia Makarova, Cynthia Gregory, Carla Fracci and Gelsey Kirkland. He danced in the movie Swan Lake with Margot Fonteyn and Rudolf Nureyev.

#2:Wendy Burr    (Wendy danced in the Movie Summer Holiday with Cliff Richards)


Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-15 23:02, Ken STEWART wrote:

Dear Ian HARVEY - ian@monaropioneers.com


To add some details to the HANSCOMBE family – William and Sarah Ann, I have discovered the birth and baptism details for Sarah FRANCIS (Francois) in Irish Catholic Transcriptions.

These are visible through my Findmypast subscription. I don’t know whether you can access these so I have attached a scanned PDF image of a download of the transcript as well as a photocopy of the original register




I have also added the baptism details of her sister Mary FRANCOIS who arrived with her on the Duchess of Northumberland in 1835.




Unfortunately I was unable to find the third sister, or anything about their parents John FRANCOIS & Mary MCCARTHY.


Thanking you for providing the very informative family web pages.

Best wishes,  Ken STEWART

Thank you Ken,

Unfortunately I don't have a Findmypast subscription so cannot use those links.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-15 21:43, Hussein Kelly wrote:

Hi Ian 

Aside from a couple of enquiries, I am not sure that I have formally introduced myself.  My name is Kelly Preston and I am the grand-daughter of Charles Henry Preston.


My uncle, William (Bill) Preston and I have been looking into our family tree and are very appreciative of all the effort that has gone into Monaro Pioneers.  We have unearthed information we didn’t know, we have solved a family mystery and, in general, have been fascinated by what we have found.


Unfortunately on the Preston side of our family, once we reach my great-great grandfather, Charles John Preston, we can’t seem to get much further.  We have obtained his marriage and death certificates in hopes they would reveal some further information but it seems to have only created further questions.  Monaro Pioneers has Charles John Preston listed as being born in England.  The death certificate we have states that he was born in Sydney, NSW.  I have searched Births, Deaths & Marriages in NSW without luck.  I am wondering if you can tell me where Monaro Pioneers obtained his birth place?


We would like to share some of the information we have on both the Preston and Thompson sides of our family, so I have cc-ed Michael into this correspondence and attached the marriage and deaths certificates as mentioned.  In regards to photographs, what would be of interest?


Thank you for your time and on-going assistance.


Thank you Kelly,

The birth place information we have is as supplied to us with the Thompson family tree and I would assume was an educated guess in lieu of any substantiated facts.  I will change our records to reflect the information in the Death certificate.

Please send any additional information you wish to contribute to Ian@monaropioneers.com.  If you also send any photos to the same address we would be very grateful.  Photos of interest are, individuals and events such as marriages, headstones etc.  Please provide descriptive information with photos. 

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-16 17:24, pat and jenny breen wrote:


I recently discovered your website and found it to be exceptionally well done and helpful.  Both my wife and myself are descendents of Monaro families listed in your pioneers section and would like to provide some additional information as well as correcting a couple of errors regarding our grandparents.


My name is Pat Breen, grandson of Isaac John Cullen b Cooma 1880 ref MP21666.  I would like to provide some additional information regarding his four younger children, including my mother, who were born after the family moved to Goulburn c1913 as well as additional information for the older children born at Cooma (my uncles and aunties). 


The suggested additions/alterations are as follows:



The information on the death of my grandmother Eliza Jane Cullen (nee Vine) is incorrect as she died in Goulburn in 1949 and was buried at St Patrick's Cemetery, Kenmore with her husband - the Eliza Jane Vine d 1931 at Katoomba is a different person but may be a relative given the tendency to name children after relatives.


Children of Isaac John and Eliza Jane Cullen: 


1    Eileen May died Camden 1972

        Spouse:    (1) Harold James ARMITT m1935 d Goulburn 1959

                            (2) John Joseph CAMERON m1961 d Camden 1972

2,3,4  details for Dorothy, Charles Leslie and Philomena are correct as far as I am aware

5    Florence died Bellambi NSW 1983

        Spouse:     Spencer John WARN m1935 Goulburn died mid 1990's

6    Selina Elizabeth born Goulburn 31 Aug1914 died Forster NSW 1 Feb 2006

        Spouse:         Patrick Breen m1943 Sydney d 20 June 1969 at Goulburn -both are buried at St Patrick's Cemetery, Kenmore (Goulburn)

7    William Henry born Goulburn c1916 d Victoria c1980

        Spouse:        Silvia Therese GANN m 1941 Redfern

8    Kenneth Roy born Goulburn c1918 d Wollongong c1988 buried at catholic cemetery Corrimal

        Spouse:        Anne Christensen m 1945 living

9    Nathaniel Percival b Goulburn c1919 d Sydney c1997

        Spouse:        Una Anderson  d c2004




My wife Jennifer (nee Woods) is the grandaughter of Samuel Henry (MP171920)and Margaret Alice Winters of Queanbeyan, her mother Kathleen was their second child and only daughter.  She needs to be added to the listing.  Unfortunately NSW BDM has her listed as "Winter" (17954/1908) which would explain why she was missed from the website. The details of Margaret Alice are also incorrect - her maiden name was Margaret Alice CULLEN born at Gisborne Vic daughter of Frank William Cullen and Catherine Maloney.  They were married in Melbourne in 1902.The following information on the Winters family will help you to update your website:


Samuel Henry Winters

       Spouse:    Margaret Alice CULLEN    m Melbourne 1902 d Queanbeyan 1938    born Gisborne Vic daughter of Frank William CULLEN  and Catherine Maloney


Children of Samuel and Margaret Winters:


1        William Francis details as per website

2        Kathleen born Queanbeyan 28 March 1908 died Revesby 29Sep 1994

                Spouse:    Charles Edward WOODS b 16 April 1901 at Redfern m Queanbeyan 1935 died Goulburn 6 April 1990  both buried at St Patricks Cemetery Kenmore

 3        Ronald - his details correct but need to add the following:

                Spouse:    Lorna Olive COX m 1943 at Junee died Melbourne date unknown (late 1940's)


4,5,6 & 7 details for Leonard, Daniel, Leo and Ambrose are as per website.


I trust this information will be of assistance to you in maintaining an accurate record of the pioneers of the monaro region and I will try to fill in some of the gaps in death places and dates for my mother's family and will pass them on to you.  Thank you once again for the great work on this site,


Regards,  Pat Breen

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-14 14:59, Wendy Pattrick-McGee wrote:

Proposed Change: Family: Pattrick,  K.L. / Sutcliffe,  D.J.
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/familygroup.php?familyID=F11892&tree=MP

Description: Birth 15/03/1927 Bangalow NSW
Died  23/08/2009 Goulburn NSW

Wendy Pattrick-McGee
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-14 15:01, Wendy Pattrick-McGee wrote:

Proposed Change: Family: Pattrick,  K. / Long,  B.G.
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/familygroup.php?familyID=F11889&tree=MP

Description: Died 15/03/2014 Seven Hills NSW

Wendy Pattrick-McGee
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-13 23:40, Margaret Crisp wrote:

Proposed Change: Crisp,  Amos (I46702)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I46702&tree=MP

Description: Amos Crisp was sentenced to "death" for stealing a watch.  This was later changed to transportation for life.

Another son was born to Amos and Elizabeth Crisp whilst Amos was a prisoner.  This was Robert Crisp born around March 1815.  He died at 6 months of age just after Amos' ship left England and was buried on the 6th September 1815 at St John the Baptist Clerkenwell, London.  Elizabeth Crisp was pregnant with Robert when Amos was arrested in September 1814, as was noted by the arresting police officer John Perks in the record of Amos' trial.

Margaret Crisp
Thank you,

Regards,  Ian


On 2016-07-13 03:08, Kellie Brown wrote:

Hi Ian,

In regards to June's assumption that Ancestry is an official source of anything.


Ancestry merely gets permission to COPY various indexes from NSW BDM...so it is NOT an "affirmation" of anything in anyway, just a copy of a source.


Ancestry's upload/copy program also screws many indexes. Names change and dates vary from the 'original' source.

Just like any 'copying' from any index, some things end up muddled.


I do see the 1855 marriage on a different 'source' which states Charles LOVE married Mary Anne KAY 19 Nov 1855 Maneroo, NSW.


NSW BDM also has it's own 'errors' in it's uploading. I had been searching for a death for many years and the only match on NSW BDM was for a lady, same name but no parents named, just an age of 25yo. I finally purchased the cert which clearly stated the lady was 75yo (not 25yo as the online index stated) and the cert named children in their 50's....which of course was my lady.


An index is not always an affirmation of anything (as you know) and a copy of that index does not verify the index.


I also noticed more people who cannot find a birth/baptism and for that reason alone state "might have been aboriginal" but looking further you can clearly see those people listed on the early Electoral Rolls and later Commonwealth Electoral Rolls so NO, not Aboriginal.


Jennett ROBIN(son)/OLIVER from the newsletter is listed on the 1903 Commonwealth Electoral Roll so was not Aboriginal. So are many others either listed on MP as "might have been Aboriginal" or mentioned in the newsletter as "might have been Aboriginal"


The Aboriginal thing is a big no-no to mention on the site. Aboriginals do not like being called Aboriginals (it is not PC) and prefer to be called Indigenous. The "Commission" also dislikes people of NON Indigenous descent claiming to be indigenous.


I see many people in the newsletters sending in data for more recent events but no one seems to be checking the Pioneers not yet listed on the MP database.

Maybe a call out in the newsletter for any "additional" families not already noted on the database.


At work last week I met quite a few people from the Monaro area who mentioned the MP site but said their line was wrong or confused. When I asked them to update they said they weren't interested as they checked the site often but did not subscribe to the newsletter or have an interest in correcting someone elses incorrect data.

((Work was as an electoral official for the Eden-Monaro region, so all were from the area))


We NEED to get those people IN.


So much more to do and hopefully another 10 years to do it,,,,LMAO.



Thank you Kellie,

Yes it is sad that some people have such little time or interest to ensure their ancestral information shown on the MP is as accurate as possible.  I am always willing to add new information and correct any errors or inaccuracies in the information we have.

Regards,  Ian

Really,,,,,you should be more concerned with people ADDING INCORRECT DATA.  The adding of incorrect  data has been going on for many years and from what I have heard (the reason the NLA will not take on)

Too many errors.

I know the site is good BUT every page has errors......some minor some BIG,,,,I see a lot of big.


A Pioneers Site needs to name the Pioneers......not half of them. The Monaro Pioneers names on half of the Pioneers and then a few later Pioneers......maybe you could as a Pioneers site....LOST and NAME the  PIONEERS .

So,,,,,name the Pioneers and not state people who came 40years later as Pioneers



Hi Kellie,

You make a good point, two in fact.  

Firstly, I am concerned there is inaccurate information in the database but how can I prevent that from happening or is that in fact a potential advantage.  The majority of folks seem to be of a positive and generous persuasion and do let us know when they find details that need fixing.  If we had tried to prevent inaccurate information from being provided we would have excluded the contact and additional contributions from so many of those folks.  The database has grown and improved as a result of inaccuracies and the most important thing as I see it is we must never be "protective or possessive" of the information we have and always be willing to add and/or change the facts as provided.  Slowly but surely we arrive at the true facts and acquire additional information and images in the process.

I don't pretend to be nor want to be the arbiter of what is correct and what is not.  

As you know, I do try to at least show a BDM Index reference as a source where possible but the size of the project now does make that nearly impossible to achieve in all instances.  As has been mentioned many times before, the MP database should be used as research guide, a starting point from which everyone should undertake their own personal research and all facts should be corroborated from official documents.  If certificate copies are provided to us, they are attached to the appropriate event in the DB to ensure that no further expense is necessary to validate an event be it a birth, a death or a marriage.  The headstone images so generously contributed by our supporters also serve as means of validation. The MP Database should never be assumed to be the "gospel" unless supporting evidence is present.

Even the BDM index references cannot be relied on for accuracy but at least they provide a starting point for further research - year of registration and the registration district. 

The MP database is not perfect nor complete and I would be very interested to see anything better that is available.

The second point you make regarding the Pioneer index is also very valid.  Who should determine which families are pioneers and at what point in time does a new family to the region no longer qualify as pioneers?  Not me!  

The MP home page clearly states "If you know of a family who should be listed on our Pioneers Index please let us know. "  

Any families missing are simply because no one has bothered to tell us or we have not detected the fact ourselves.  We need all the help we can get in this process.

The index was the creation of Pattrick Mould and was originally intended to simply be a pointer to a web page containing information and or images about that particular family.  Thus no web page, no index entry.  The index only contains one entry being the head of a family but could quite easily contain spouse(s) and all immediate family members as well but where do we "draw the line".  

In the 13 years the project has been running, things have changed and the concept of a separate "page" per family has been superseded by the database with dynamic rather than static information.  Perhaps a name change for the index would make more sense?  Say for example "Family web page index"?  

There is no doubt that improvements could and should be made, perhaps Michael Povey will consider this as he takes the MP project forward.  Perhaps someone else will volunteer to help and take this on?  The more resources, the more activity, the more progress that can be made.

What saddens and concerns me most is your statement "I know the site is good BUT every page has errors......some minor some BIG,,,,I see a lot of big."   How can I encourage you to tell me about the things you find that need to be fixed?  

I have always considered it to be fundamental and mandatory that corrective information received must be addressed immediately as a mark of respect and appreciation to the person contributing those new facts.  If you tell me what to fix, I will do it immediately.  Your meticulous work has always impressed me and left me in no doubt as to accuracy.  The support you have provided in the past has been appreciated and I look forward hopefully to your ongoing help.

Incidentally, the NLA does have the MP site archived but do not have the infrastructure nor the foresight to handle the database. 

Your humble and obedient servant,  Ian


Come on folks, tell us about the things that need to be fixed and the missing families who should be listed in the index.  We need your help and your input.

Inaccuracies and omissions exist because good people do nothing.

Hi Ian,

The site may have begun as Monaro Pioneers but has grown to a Monaro and Regions Database.

It will keep growing for many years and for many miles, towns, states and countries which will really result in it just being a Genealogical Database.

Not that that is a problem but the bigger it grows without any limits and no required 'research' needed the more chance there is of it becoming like Ancestry Tree's.


I know there are many dedicated people searching for the loose ends but most of those are modern era.

Getting back to the Monaro Pioneers idea and working on those lines from the beginning, for those Pioneer Families and fixing or finalising them to complete (or fill the body of) the Pioneers Index is what I am more concerned about.

An actual Pioneers Index that can be placed online, anywhere and not just archived because it has no limits. The 'core' of the larger database. Which can be checked, managed and verified without anyone needing to purchase thousands of certificates.


It is too hard to verify and check every tree or bit of information that is donated by people, who have a range of knowledge and skills between 'began yesterday' and 'been doing it for years', especially when the data being added ranges 200years and from more than one state and/or country.

I'm not worried about the site as a whole as it is getting too large and extends too far but more concerned about getting people to work on the "core" of the site. Pioneers Index, which is how this all began, but now seems to be a minor, almost forgotten area.


Even the people accessing the FaceBook page and the newsletter mention data which either is NOT on the MP database or is different on the MP database. I had been asking them to UPDATE the MP database with their 'new' data but most just shrug it off and others just say no, they cannot be bothered.


This is where you or the others come in and need to make a mention on the FB page asking members to update the MP site OR put a mention in the newsletter asking members to check their family lines and correct/update anything they find is outdated.

Would be even better if people could be asked to check 'a different' family line and look for errors. You could pick a different letter each few months and ask people to double check the surnames beginning with A, then a month or so later B etc. Would give everyone the chance to feel needed and important, as well as feeling they are contributing while giving the MP Database a going over checking for mistakes.


Anyway, I have so much more to say but it seems like it won't do any good.

I hope that people will join in and start rechecking the old database, as the names from the old database are actually the "clues" to the Pioneers who are missing from the site.

A Pioneer Family has 4 sons and they all marry. Where did their wives come from?

So many of the original Pioneers listed have dead end lines. Sons and daughters who have no descendants line or in-laws who have no ancestral line YET most of these are original Pioneers not mentioned on the site yet.



Hi Kellie,

Thank you for the input, once again you have raised some excellent points and given me much food for thought.  As you have probably gathered my role in the MP project is winding down as I too am doing.  The project needs to progress and further develop but it is beyond the capacity of one person now to fully address all the possible areas of improvement that could be undertaken.  The database has stabilised now with additions and corrections to existing families still occurring but at a much slower pace than before.  No new major families have been added for quite some time.  Whilst it can never be considered to be "finished" it can be seen as no longer expanding.

I would like to invite you to become a member of the project team.  Why not become the instigator of the changes and enhancements you recommend, change the things you see need improving and in particular develop the Pioneers Index as per your recommendations.  You could also help maintain the database directly, should you wish to do so and hopefully in your discussions with those who "just shrug it off and others just say no, they cannot be bothered", you can have a positive influence to overcome such inertia.

I have discussed your potential inclusion with David and Michael and they enthusiastically endorse the idea.

Please consider the offer and hopefully become a driving force for the Project and help ensure its ongoing existence, accuracy, authenticity and usefulness. 

I look forward to your decision.

Regards,  Ian



From: Iain
Sent: 12 July, 2016 4:59 PM

Dear Ian,


Should any descendants be interested in further material on Herbert Henry Bartley then the attachments above and the link below (to his Army file) will reveal what is in the records.


However, there is a book on the 53rd Battalion.


Also, he served at Gallipoli (with the 1st Battalion?)


On 19 July, at a ceremony at Fromelles, my relative will pause to remember him.  HHB was not one from the Fromelles battle whose remains were identified and re-interred.  He is commemorated on a memorial at VC Corner, as shown in one of the attachments above.




With kind regards,  Iain Macinnis


Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-10 08:33, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: McClelland,  Moody John (I310993)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I310993&tree=MP

Description: OBITUARY Mr J. M. McCLELLAND The death occurred at the Goulburn District Hospital of Mr. John Moodie McClelland, 60, of Rhyanna, on Wednesday last. Deceased had been suffering ill-health for some months and had been under hospital treatment previously. Mr. McClelland, who was unmarried, was well liked and respected by all who knew him. He was a native of Komungla and was the son of the late Mr, James McClelland, of Goulburn, He is survived by two brothers, James and Andrew (both of Sydney), and one step-brother, Gordon (Bungonia), One brother was killed at the last war. The funeral left Jones's Chapel for the Presbyterian Cemetery, last Friday.
Goulburn Evening Post (NSW : 1940 - 1954), Tuesday 8 June 1943, page 2

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-10 08:09, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: McClelland,  Samuel (I227561)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I227561&tree=MP

Description: MARRIED,
AT the Manse, on the 5th instant, by the Rev. Mr.Mackenzie, SAMUEL, third son of Mr. JAMES McCLELLAND, to SARAH, daughter of Mr. ABRAHAM WITHERS of Towrang, Goulburn.
The Goulburn Herald and Chronicle (NSW : 1864 - 1881), Sat 21 Feb 1874, Page 4

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-10 07:50, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: McClelland,  James (I259534)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I259534&tree=MP

Description: MR. J. McCLELLAND The death occurred in the Goulburn District Hospital early, on Sunday morning of James McClelland, at he age of 77. The late Mr. McClelland was born at Bronte, and came to live in the Goulburn district with his parents, the late James and Jane McClelland, where they lived on the Springfield property. With his father and brothers the late Mr. McClelland was employed at Springfield, and when he was working as a shepherd boy with his brother, the late Samuel McClelland, he saw the encounter of the Faithfull Brothers and the bushrangers. After leaving Springfield he went to live it Bangalore and about 25 years ago came to live in Goulburn. A member of a large family, the late Mr. McClelland had four brothers and five sisters die before him. Besides his widow, Bridget, the daughter of the late Mr, and Mrs. J. Rudd, of Wileroo, he is survived by one brother, John, of Springfield, one sister, Mrs. Susan Brooks, of Flemington, and six sons, Moodey, Andrew, James, Gordon, John and Ronald. One son was killed at the war. The funeral left his residence at 50 Citizen Street for the Presbyterian Cemetery yesterday afternoon at 4.30.
Goulburn Evening Penny Post (NSW : 1881 - 1940), Tuesday 18 May 1937, page 4

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



From: Peter Platts
Sent: 3 April, 2016 11:36 PM
Subject: re: Matthew Platts

Hi Ian,

My name is Peter Platts and I am working on the Platts Family Tree.


re: Matthew Platts, son of George Platts and Emily Nicholson, George being the son of the Monaro Pioneer William Platts. I am one of Matthew and Sheilah Edmonds 6 children, 3 daughters and 3 sons.


Matthew born 29th December 1917, is certainly not dead with date unknown as indicated on the Monaro Pioneer Family site. Dad resides in the Bull Creek Air Force retirement Estate hospital in Perth, WA. The body is not great but the mind is still good as he heads towards his 99th birthday, still hoping to outlive his older brother Jack who passed away at the age of 99.


I have much material. The only other point of interest is re: Sarah Sellors who married George Platts and is the mother of William. I have a English Marriage Transcript that indicates her father's name is Thomas Sellors not Roger as the website indicates.


Anyway I am away this week but will be back to get more info later.


Thanks for your work in putting this together. I am recently retired and if you wish to contact me for any details please do so either by email or phone on 0424150017.


Cheers - Peter

Hi Peter,

Thank you for letting us know, I will amend our records to reflect the correct information. If you can provide any further details or image copies of any documents or photos we would be most appreciative.

Regards,  Ian

Hi Ian,

Just a quick update re: Dad - Matthew Platts


Unfortunately, it is with great sadness that I inform you that Dad passed away yesterday, 9/7/2016, at the Air Force Retirement Estate at Bull Creek, Perth, WA. His mind was still good but the body was struggling and after a little stroke earlier in the week, he passed away peacefully just after 10 am.


Dad was the last surviving child of 9 born to George Leonard Platts and Emily Eliza Nicholson so it brings a family history to an end. His grandfather was William Platts one of the pioneers for the Bombala/Bega area.


I am still doing the Platts tree and have lots of wonderful information which I will share at a later stage. I plan to send a quick piece to the Bombala Times in the hope that they may publish it.


Cheers - Peter Platts

Thank you Peter,

Please accept our sincere condolences for your sad loss.

Regards,  Ian



From: Iain
Sent: 10 July, 2016 4:32 PM

Dear Ian,


Amongst my grandfather’s papers I came across the attached; the image is the reverse of a postcard.


Checking against the MP ‘1st WW Enlisters’ I believe it to show a note from Herbert henry Bartley to my grandfather, Angus Donald Macinnis, of the NSW Mounted Police, and at that time serving in Delegate.  HH Barley was KIA at Fromelles on 19 July 1916.


I note that there were several enlistees by the name of Bartley, two from Delegate, and several from Cooma.


If there are family descendants who would like the card I’ll forward it to them.


As I have a relative on route to Fromelles I’ll ask that they pause and call HHB to mind.


Kind regards,  Iain Macinnis

Thank you Iain,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-08 18:25, grace pundyk wrote:

Hello there,

I'm writing to you with some more information about my great great grandfather William Hawes. I found a notice about his death that you may find useful for the Eden-Monaro site - which is wonderful, but the way. Keep up the great work!

Kind regards
Grace Pundyk



Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-08 12:29, Catherine Kennedy wrote:

Proposed Change: Kennedy,  Pretoria Kathleen Mary Louisa (I150759)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I150759&tree=MP

Description: hi...
Pretoria and Albert Whitby had another baby after Mervyn Ernest...this baby girl died of TB not long before Pretoria died in 1930. Their second child would have been born in Pambula and is buried in Pambula Cemetery with Pretoria, her mother Catherine Ann, her father Thomas James Kennedy and Catherine and Thomas' other children Michael J, Gertrude A. Irene C and William C (Crofton) were buried at Bemboka Cemetery.

Catherine Kennedy

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-08 10:56, Laurel James wrote:

Dear Ian,


I have tried  to contact Christine Robinson, who provided the Barrett information---- without success.  I would appreciate your assistance in correcting the errors that I have found to date regarding my family.

Lineage—Emma Evelyn Thomas,    Mother Clara Ann Eldridge,   Grandmother Agnes Amelia Eldridge   GGrandfather George Barrett


1.        Emma Evelyn Blanchfield, formerly Turner, nee  Thomas -- died Bundaberg ,Queensland  15th July 1985.  Buried Gungahlin Cemetery, Canberra ACT

2.       Herbert David Blanchfield---died Bega NSW 24th June 1997. Buried Gungahlin Cemetery, Canberra. ACT

3.       Walter Blanchfield,  formerly Walter Emmanuel Edwin Joseph Turner--- was adopted by  Herbert David Blanchfield in 1932  when my parents married.

4.       Laurel Emma Trebreh Blanchfield ---is very much alive!!!!


This is the second time that I have had to make a request to you people regarding incorrect information  and thank you for your past assistance.


Sincerely,  Laurel James [nee Blanchfield]

Thank you,

We are happy to rectify any errors in information that has been supplied to us.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-08 08:46, Joan Limon wrote: 

Hello, Ian

I am not sure what format you need this information in, but I will send what I have and you might tell me if this is ok.


My Grandfather was Edward CANDISH, not Edward William as it appears on Monaro Pioneers site. He was born on 12.2.1860 in Carlton, Melbourne and died 30.7.1938 in Queanbeyan. He is buried in the Riverside (Pioneer) Cemetery in Queanbeyan. He married Beatrice Mary Styles on 17.5.1911 at Pudman Creek NSW and had the following children:


Edward William 1912-1939

Herbert Charles 1913-1989

Frederick George 1913-1914

Doris Catherine 1914-2001

Douglas Arthur 1915-2012

Beatrice Mary 1917-

Oliver James 1919-2015

Samuel Ainslie 1921-2002

Leeta 1925-2012

Freda 1927-1996


Edward Candish's parents were F-Frederick George Candish  and M-Catherine Jane Downes (known as Kate) born 25.6.1837 Sydney, died 5.6.1868 Sydney. Her F-William Downes M- Mary Driscoll, both from Ireland.

Frederick George b 3.11.1827 London, d 29.4.1899 Drummoyne, Sydney NSW. He married  Catherine Jane Candish 24.1.1854 in Melbourne.            Their children were:


Frederick 1855-1947

William 1856- 1943

Edward 1860-1938

George 1862-1924

Catherine Jane 1864-1932

Sydney 1868-1942   


Frederick married 2 more times after this but I don't know if you want the details of these marriages. Please let me know if you want this sent to you in some other format.


Best wishes,  Joan Limon

Thank you,

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-08 08:44, Warwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Dyball,  Charles (I75436)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I75436&tree=MP

Description: Inquest into his death:

THE Friends and Relatives of the late MR. CHARLES DYBALL are requested to attend his Funeral to leave the Church of England at about 12 noon on SATURDAY for Canberra Cemetery. H. LAZARUS Undertaker.
Queanbeyan Age (NSW : 1907 - 1915), Fri 16 Aug 1912 Page 3

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



On 2016-07-08 07:35, Lisa Maree Ellett wrote:

Proposed Change: Family: Crimmins,  Patrick James / Muriel
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/familygroup.php?familyID=F132594&tree=MP

Description: Hi together with my father who is the only child of Muriel and Patrick, we could provide some details missing in our family tree.
My Father is Peter A Crimmins, born 1939 he is living in Canberra.
He has  six children of which I am the eldest. three from his first marriage two  born to him and my mother and a child adopted at 3months as we'll, and two step children and another child with his second wife.

I can also see some gaps we could help with for Patrick Crimmins' siblings and his wife, my grandmothers family tree. her Name was Ellen 'Muriel' O'Donnell, and I did see her parents on this site, but 4 of tiger children including her are missing. My fathers second cousin is from this tree and he is also alive. There were only 3 of the seven children in my grandmothers family that had children.

My sisters from my fathers first marriage have both had children, with some of these children bearing the Crimmins surname.
I have unfortunately not had my own children, but have four stepchildren and I live in regional Western Australia.

My father has a son, my brother from his second marriage who's name is Peter James Crimmins. He was born 1987, he  has not had children yet.

My Dad will be here visiting me in about 5 weeks for a week.

Love to help, this website is fantastic!

Lisa Maree Ellett
Hi Lisa Maree,

Thank you for the offer, we would be very grateful for any additional information you can provide.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-08 04:06, Wqarwick McCall wrote:

Proposed Change: Gregory,  John (I75511)
Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers
Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I75511&tree=MP

Description: Marriage

Name                               John Gregory
Spouse's Name                  Margaret Swaine
Event Date                                  01 Apr 1844
Event Place                        Sydney, New South Wales, Australia
Marital Status                    Single
Spouse's Marital Status       Single
Citing this Record

"Australia Marriages, 1810-1980," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTZS-HY5 : 12 December 2014), John Gregory and Margaret Swaine, 01 Apr 1844; citing Sydney, New South Wales, Australia, reference cn 1977; FHL microfilm 993,983.

Warwick McCall

Regards, Ian



From: the haighs

Sent: 8 July, 2016 3:20 PM

Subject: Haigh Descendant.

Mr Ian Harvey,

My name is Lance Haigh.

I am the grandson of the late Leslie John Haigh, born 1892 Bega.

I live in the Sydney suburb of Glebe.

Myself and my wife have just returned from visiting a memorial site dedicated to the 'Ham' family in Muswellbrook and Sandy Hollow.

Mildred Ham was my Grandmother from my fathers side ....Mother of Garnet

(Les) Haigh.


I have checked out your site and can tell you there is info missing....re marriages etc in relation to my Grandfather Haigh.


My wife and I plan to visit Bega as a matter of family history chasing.

Would you be interested in meeting,where I can provide additional facts to the continuing line of Haighs'.


We have not set a date as of yet to travel down.

It has come as a big surprise to find out that my Grandfather came from a such a big family.


Regards,  G.L.Haigh.

Hi Lance,

I do not live in the Bega Area, I live in "the Shire".  However, I would be very appreciative of any additional information you can provide to add to our database.

Can you possibly send me your information by email?

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-07-07 09:35, Jan & Bob Grant wrote:

Hello Ian 

Re the message below from the newsletter. There is a listing in the Cootamundra Cemetery Inscriptions book for Thornleigh Cameron Whitby died 25/1/1980 aged 54 yrs? with supposedly a concrete cross. The Cootamundra Shire Council would be the people to contact regarding the cemetery. If a headstone ended up in Picton it seems more likely transported by vehicle rather than by any flooding J 

Regards,  Jan

Thank you Jan,

I was being facetious in my comments about the flood, hoping it might give someone a good laugh.

Regards,  Ian



On 2016-06-18 21:30, deborah hayes wrote:

Hi Ian

Hoping you can help. I am after contact details for the Cootamundra Cemetery.

I am from Picton NSW and after out recent devastating floods a head stone was found in Menangle street Picton, the headstone belongs to Thornleigh Cameron Whitby who died in 1980 aged 45, after some  research i have discovered that he is buried in Cootamundra and need to confirm this as soon as possible. The people who found the headstone will be going to Wagga in a few weeks and said they are able to return the headstone if it does belong there A speedy reply would be most welcome

Regards Debbie

Hi Debbie,

Sorry, I don't know any contacts for the Cootamundra Cemetery.  It must have been one helluva flood to wash a headstone from Cootamundra to Picton!

Regards,  Ian


From: Leah Burke
Sent: 2016-07-07 7:18 PM
Subject: newsletter

Hi David


Allow me to extend my very big thank you for all you and your group do for the Monaro Pioneers..website and newsletters.


I have no idea about the workings of the web and admire anyone who can navigate it and put together this fantastic site..


Thanks to everyone

Leah Burke.



Proposed Change: Williams,  Thomas (I161778)

Tree: Eden Monaro Pioneers

Link: http://monaropioneers.com/TNG/getperson.php?personID=I161778&tree=MP

Description: Hi Ian


I would like to report that Thomas Williams, son of Mary Milham (later Sheather) was in fact Thomas Milham. There is no evidence that Mary was a widow when she married James Sheather. Thomas Milham was baptised at Ewhurst Sussex on 4 Feb 1821, no father is mentioned. He came to New South Wales with the Sheather families. I think that an early researcher confused his name from the passenger list or ships diagram of accommodation. Thomas Milham never married, making it more difficult to track him, and he has no official death entered in the register. A search of the Trove newspapers however, brings up the report on an inquest into the death of Thomas Milham alias Sheather who died 18 Jan 1879 at Wagga Hospital after a fall from his horse. Apparently, at that time, is was not unknown for a death resulting in an inquest not to have a separate death registration.


Diane Cole


Regards,  Ian



The purpose of this newsletter is four-fold:
1. To let people know about all our activities including: the "Back to Nimitybelle" Book and the Monaro Pioneers Website.
2. To collect email and postal addresses of as many people as we can, so that they may be invited to contribute to this archive.
3. To collect Historical information about the Monaro District and the Families that have lived there.
4. And most importantly the newsletter is a venue for people who have an interest in the district to keep in contact with each other.


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